Episode 37: WOWNet

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We're really excited to hear what topics you want us to cover. So today I'm really excited to have, um, a bunch of women on the podcast with me today. Uh, we're gonna be talking about an amazing program that Oregon State University Extension offers it's called Women Owning Woodlands. Um, it's, or for short WOWNet, the Women Owning Woodlands Network.

And on the podcast with me today is Tiffany Hopkins. Can you say, hi, Tiffany? Hi, uh, Tiffany is the coordinator of the program. Tiffany, can you tell us a little bit more about yourself and, um, how you got into this role? Yeah, um, so I'll start by saying, hi, my name is Tiffany Hopkins and yeah, I coordinate the WowNet program and also the master woodland managers program for OSU Forestry and Natural Resources Extension.

Um, I, so I guess like my background as far as schooling as I went to OSU for my, um, bachelor's and I had a emphasis in, well, so my bachelor's is in forestry and natural resources, and then I had an emphasis in community outreach education. So I just knew that I wanted to do some sort of educational outreach.

Um, and I heard someone from extension talk about what she did, one of my classes and fell in love with the entire concept. Um, so I went to West Virginia University and studied under a, uh, extension agent there. So I got some really good hands-on work with extension through that. And then this job just opened up right at the right time and I got to come back to Oregon.

I was born and raised here, so that was kind of my dream. And yeah, I, I love being the coordinator for, for WOWNet. It's a really awesome program. Yeah, it is an awesome program. And a lot of that is thanks to you too, um, and the great programs that you put on. So thanks for finding your way back to Oregon and, uh, showing all these women a great time.

So, um, tell us a little bit more about the Women Owning Woodlands Program. Uh, what's, what's its history? What's it about? Yeah, so it's been around for about 15 years, and as the story has been passed down to me, um, it originated in the back of a pickup truck with a group of women who were at just a generic forestry tour.

Um, and the women found themselves gathered together with, um, Nicole Strong, who is the one who was kind of the brain child behind this whole thing. And they were just talking and, and asking her the questions that they didn't feel comfortable asking in front of the whole group and talking amongst each other about their experiences and those kinds of things.

And then they kind of just all, were like, wait, we need a group where we can do this and, and feel safe to do this. And it's like special for us. And so Nicole just kind of took that and ran with it and started, um, a steering committee comprised of pretty much those women and they started the network.

Um, now we have about 400 women that are across the state of Oregon. Um, it's so if you kind of like hone into the name a peer learning network, there's a lot of emphasis on the experiences and stories and, um, knowledge of the participants. So it's less top down programming. So if we put on a, if I put on a workshop, it's, it's equally an expert, quote unquote, coming in and talking about a topic and the women who are there being able to ask questions and engage with each other and spend time with each other and share their experiences.

And so creating that like, networking opportunity. Um, and I think that from my perspective, that's what sets WOWNet apart from other, um, offerings to woodland owners. Um, and yeah, it, it's also a national program, so there's different types and formats of WOWNet across the entire country. Um, I think as far as I know Oregon is, I think there's a little bit of a debate if it's like the actual first program.

Um, and so, and I don't care, I don't get into the debate, but yeah, if it was the first one or not, but it is like the biggest and most substantial at this point, and that's just because of, I think a lot of the work that Nicole did to make sure that there's a coordinator. So a lot of other places don't actually have a specific coordinator for the program, and so we're really lucky that half of my time goes towards, um, WOWNet.

That's great. And it's so nice to have people that are dedicated to empower, empowering the education of women, especially around forestry. Um, and it's great to have this program here. Uh, what have you, are you able to share some of the feedback that you've gotten from the program, or how do people like it?

Oh, yeah. Um, I mean, all the feedback always is positive, so that's good. Um, just like in general, as far as like, you know, specific to topics, I'm sure there's some, there's always some things that could be better, but as the program as a whole, it's very well received. Um, I think there's, there's some people who don't understand like, why would that be necessary?

Um, and there's some women who don't understand why it would be necessary, and I don't really look at that as a bad thing. Um, I think that's awesome because that woman has enough confidence that she does not feel like she would, can't ask questions or, you know, whatever. Um, but yeah, I think as far as specifically, um, yeah, I don't know like how specific I, but I think for one of the big groups that WOWNet helps is women who, um, didn't grow up in the forestry community like they were somehow brought into it, I guess most likely via marrying someone who was in the forestry world or who owns forest property or because a, a parent passed away, or both their parents passed away and, and they inherited forest property.

But because historically that wasn't something that a woman or girl was involved in, they didn't work in the woods as much with their dad as their maybe brothers did. And so they just have less experience and less knowledge and feel really intimidated. Um, and so that's a huge area where we get a lot of positive feedback.

Like I feel like I was just gonna have to sell my property, or I was drowning in it or all these different things. And then I found WOWNet and saw all these other women who are out there doing this work and realized, I, I can do it too. Um, and even in my brain, more powerful than that. Now I have a team of women to support me in that work, and I can reach out to them if I'm having a hard time.

And I think just women in general, that, that feels really empowering to me, but especially around a topic where likely you don't have this in common with your friends, with your other girlfriends, you know, it's like probably most of your other friends don't own large chunks of property and manage forests as a part of their life.

And so to be able to find this outlet, that's also where a lot of like positive feedback comes from. Um, I can't remember somebody one time said like, all my other friends think I'm weird and you guys all just understand me, or something like that. That's so nice. How it builds builds that community and a, and a friendship, you know, in a different realm than you, you would normally see.

Yeah. It's so awesome. Yeah. And you know, those women that you know, attend or maybe don't understand, um, or people that don't understand, you know, why the group's needing it makes me think about those dating website commercials, you know, when they're like, our goal is to, for us to use us and then get rid of us, you know, is, you know, we, we wanna be out there empowering you, educating you, and making you feel like you can build your community.

And if you feel like you've gotten that, that's great. We, you know, you won't.. Yeah, totally. Some people, like, I guess in this world where it's all about numbers, it's like, um, bad if a woman kind of stops coming to WOWNet stuff, I think some people, like when when we get to talk to Debbi, she'll probably be a part of WOWNet for forever.

Even though she is a genius and all these things. It's not just about that. It's not that she has the knowledge and capability and all that to participate in all these other things, but there's so many other benefits that end up coming out of it that, um, that's kind of a whole separate thing, but if a woman, there's a woman that like pops into my mind that kind of followed that exact trajectory, like her husband passed away.

She thought she was gonna sell the property to this like developer, and then randomly just came to a WOWNet little hike and, and met with me in the parking lot afterwards and was crying and was like, I can't believe that I just found this and she came to every single WOWNet thing that I had no matter where it was in the state for multiple years.

And then she just kind of stopped and I started seeing her throughout that time at Tree School and I think she was wanting to take Master woodland manager and just so she, through WOWNet, was able to really build all this knowledge and confidence and then kind of started going to all these other things and maybe just didn't have as much time or you know, whatever the case is.

But I don't look at that as like, WOWNet failing or that's sad that we, you know, lost one of our numbers from our amount of people who are in the program. I think that's a huge success story. It's like, great, like you got what you needed from our program and now you kind of graduated or something. I don't know.

Um, but yeah, I think a lot of other people stick with it. And can keep coming back no matter what, because of all the other things that it has to offer besides just the empowering piece of it, I guess. Yeah, definitely. And I, all the WOWNet events that I get to attend and that I'm lucky enough to be asked to, to teach, help, teach at, or help you coordinate, um, are always some of my favorite events.

They're, they're so fun. Yeah, me too. Okay. Well, you mentioned Debbi, so I want to also introduce our audience to Debbi Lawrence. Welcome to the podcast, Debbi. Hi, everyone. Debbi, tell us a little bit about yourself. Well, um, I'm 57 years old. I live in a town called Halfway. Um, it's actually located Halfway, is located in a valley called Pine Valley and there's about 290 people who live in the city of Halfway and roughly 1,750 people that live in the valley.

And so I actually live about a mile outside of Halfway considered in the valley. I have two daughters who are grown. Um, one of 'em went into forestry and environment and the other one is an emergency nurse, uh, who lives in Hillsboro. And then my daughter, actually the other daughter who's forestry environmental ed, actually lives here in Halfway with us right now.

I have a husband, been married 30 years. We're building a house on a 17 acre piece of property that didn't have one tree on it when we bought it. Um, little under two years ago. So, um, I came from the west side where we had trees and we had a Christmas tree farm and I was, um, this is a really, this is a negative story gone good though.

Um, I actually went through an audit one year, maybe 2005, and the auditors, uh, said, oh, well you're just a small tree farm. It looks like a hobby farm here. When in fact, you know, what we were doing is creating this Christmas tree farm. So it took a lot of money and a lot of investment, a lot of up, you know, upfront stuff.

And, um, we didn't have a lot of revenue for a long time. So the auditors actually said to me, they said, well, you really need to join a professional group. You need to look like you're taking this seriously. And so I asked around in our community, which was all wineries basically, and hazelnuts. And somebody said to me, well, have you ever heard of the group OSWA?

And I was like, no. And that's Oregon State, um, Woodlands Association. Am I saying that right, Tiff? Oregon. OSWA, Oregon State Woodlands Association. Oregon Small Woodlands Association. Oh, small. There you go. Small woodlands. And so I joined and I was like, wow. Like, I was like never so thankful to go through a horrible audit and, um, became very involved.

I loved it. I met all these people. I mean, at the time I was, you know, I don't know. I suppose I was like late thirties, early forties. And, um, they were all old timers, right? They were all like my grandpa's and I loved going and they, you know, they were loggers and they had all these great stories and I learned a ton from these old timers.

And I literally was the youngest person in those meetings. And eventually, uh, people, those people would, um, whatever, completely retire from the business and their, uh, children were taking over their woodlands or they were selling. And I could see, I watched the dynamics of Oregon small woodlands change to people my age or even a little bit younger coming into it.

And their questions were so great, you know, and, um, this community kind of formed within the Oregon Small Woodlands, and that was the one in Washington County, specifically what I'm talking about. Um, and then from there, uh, they have all these landowner things where you get to go out and walk on people's land, you know, and all these old timers would bring out all their cool old equipment, you know, and it was, it was lovely.

And I remember sitting with somebody and they, they go, they go, do you know anything about a WOWNet? And I'm like, no. And they're like, well, Debbi, it's like you and I, it's these women out there trying to learn about forestry and woodlands. And, um, so anyway, she invited me to a WOWNet event, and that's when I met Tiffany.

And, um, mean, I just got hooked immediately. Because you do feel really isolated, right? Even though, like I said, I've been married 30 years. My husband has zero interest in this. Like, like he wants to live out in the middle of nowhere. That was really easy. He liked all the trees, but he had no interest in taking care of it.

He, um, just wanted to live in it, you know, and just enjoyed that part of it. Right. So it was really up to me. And then raising my daughters in, in a, in a way that we could manage it. So, yeah, otherwise I've been in teaching and a principal and community development for over 30 years in my professional life.

So, yeah. Great. That was a, that was a great story. I'm so happy to hear that. Um, uh, so you did go into a little bit about why you joined WowNet. Is there, once you got there, uh, is you wanna share with us a little bit about why you stayed? It was like having a bunch of, uh, older sisters around me, to be honest.

It was like having people, you know, and you could ask the dumb question and not feel dumb. You know, when you're with men and they are all in this industry of logging or timber or Christmas trees or whatever they are in forestry, it is intimidating. They are very knowledgeable. Um, they're very adapt to using machinery.

They understand how to fix things, right. And it just feels super uncomfortable to like, raise your hand in one of those meetings and go, yeah. So like my chainsaw, it stopped working and um, I really didn't know how to put the chain back on, you know? I mean, that's just, that's just like, so, I don't know, so lame for those people who do it all the time.

Blindfolded practically. So they, the people that go just make you feel comfortable and we're all really trying to do the same thing. And that is, um, honor our property that we're responsible with and, you know, learn how to do that. Yeah, that's, that's so great. Yeah. We all just wanna get along and, and take care of the, take care of the woods, right?

Um, maybe some of you can remind me how to put a chainsaw. Um, uh, chain, uh, chain. What's that? What is it even called? Chainsaw chain back on. I did it a long time ago, but I haven't gotten to do it in a while. I'll have to come visit you, Debbi. Debbi hosted a, a small diameter tree falling workshop for WOWNet at her property with her daughter.

They taught it together and they went through the whole thing with the chainsaw and then showed us how to fall a tree. That's amazing. It was pretty cool. Yeah. Wish I was there. Yeah. We've never done anything, never done anything like that. It was awesome. Well, and my favorite thing about that was is I actually, um, was blessed to restart a ladies group in the town I lived in and it had, it was an ag Women of Ag group called Ladies of Laurel from 1928.

And so, um, I took some time to reopen that and revive that. And we started with five people at a potluck. Sounded a lot like the Nicole Strong story where I just, I was dying to know my neighbors and we were, you know, acres apart. And so we just, um, I, I literally just hand wrote an invitation saying, would you wanna come to my house and meet me and have a potluck I'll, I'll make the, I'll make the meat and provide the wine, right?

Which was stupid 'cause I didn't drink wine and they, it was all winery people. But I did, and I, I learned quite quickly that I should not offer people wine. Um, so, uh, yeah, like please don't.. It's the thought that counts. Yeah. Right. Yeah. It got 'em there. Um, and at that table we discussed how important it was to have girlfriends.

Yeah. And, um, and then literally, I remember asking people, well, what are five things that you wanna share about yourself? And as we went around the table and shared those five things, it was ridiculous how we were all the same. Mm-hmm. It was like arts, nature, environment, hiking, biking, walking, whatever, family, you know, cooking.

It was like all the, it was like all the things that make you proud to be a woman. Mm-hmm. And not, and not shamed about those things. And um, from there it grew to 75 people. And so when we hosted the thing, you know, I, I remember telling Tiffany, I'm like, I got women. These women wanna know, you know, they wanna know how to run a chainsaw.

They're excited to learn more. And they had never heard about WOWNet. So it was just a super fun opportunity to bring those same women together, that we would get together and do other stuff together, um, to a whole new. Uh, a, a whole new place of safety where they could learn and be okay about being a woman.

Mm-hmm. And doing the work of the typical man, I guess. That's great. And, um, so I, you kind of, you kind of alluded to some of this already, but, um, why is the, so why else is WOWNet really important to you, or important in general, do you think, and you know, more specifically to you, what has it offered you that maybe you haven't found somewhere else?

Well, I, I would say there's nothing else like it. I mean, honestly, there's, there's really nothing else where women can get together and freely learn and, and get information and grow in something they're passionate about in forestry or environment. And, and what Tiffany has done is, I mean, it's amazing. I just love what she has done and, and she's, she's so humble and dealing with Tiffany, I mean, she's so knowledgeable and just a wonderful person to be around and...

So knowledgeable, and yet she always brings us to the table and, and makes us feel like we are the ones that have the information, which is, you know, most of the time, not true. Uh, we have information to share, but it's Tiffany who, who does this. So I, I love that about her. I love that about, um, and I, I know that's why people come, right?

Like, who wants to come to an event where you have a prideful, you know, really, I don't know, like non-open minded person to learning and engaging others. And, uh, she provides an environment that's very safe and very loving, um, and easy, easy to engage in. So I, I definitely wanted to say that's one thing that's super unique about WOWNet.

Yeah, I, I totally a hundred percent agree with you about Tiffany. She is, she does that in our workspace as well. Makes everything really comfortable and, um, really does a great job at building camaraderie around our, our team. So it's great to hear that she just said around the woodland owners as well. So a hundred percent agree, and I think you're being hard on yourself about the, uh, not knowing anything thing.

Mm-hmm. Um, having experience on that land gives you a lot of knowledge, um, that you can share with the other landowners that you're that you're with. So don't forget that. Um, you guys are gonna make me cry. Yeah.

Okay, so Debbi, what's your favorite part about WOWNet? Um, so we are all so busy, right? I mean, everybody is super busy, but people will put, they put time aside for things that they're passionate about, right? They always will, like, look at the holidays. Everybody's so busy, but they tend to make the holidays happen in their household usually.

Um, so my favorite part about WOWNet is that it speaks to a passion that I don't know, but I think sometimes we're born with these passions. Like I didn't, I. I don't know that I acquired it. I've just always been a lover of being outside and working outside with my hands and being a part of the trees, you know, and things that happen in the trees.

So, um, I, I just, I love that she gives us and WOWNet gives us a space to do that and be with other people who make the time in their schedule to pursue their passion, you know? So everybody, when you go out there, it's filled with energy because everybody has cut time out of their schedule to make this happen.

Everybody has. And so, um, you're, you're coming together with this, you know, just super positive group of people. Like nobody shows up and who's just like a dick about it, to be honest. They're just like super happy, right? Like, they're like, yeah, we're here. You know, and they're game on, you know, so it's really, it's a, it is a lovely experience.

I think that's really good, what you said about the energy, that's something that I've always noticed about WOWNet events specifically, is there is this certain type of energy and sometimes I crave it. Like sometimes I'll just be like, I, we haven't had a wound net thing in too long, like, like during covid and stuff.

I was just like, I can't, I, I, I need it. I need to feel you all 'cause yeah, it's just something different about being around a group of women who have carved out the time and who are passionate about this same topic that you are, that I always leave there with my cup feeling so full. And I think that's unique because, because I coordinate another program with woodland owners, I can directly compare and it's like, it's not exactly the same.

I think a lot of times when I leave some of those other things, I'm like, oh my gosh, I'm so drained. Like that was so much work. I, I need to like, recover and, and after WOWNet, I'm like, okay, what's the next thing we're doing? Because I'm just like so excited about it. And it's definitely something about that energy that you're, that you were talking about, Debbi, that, that, that is unique to WOWNet and, and probably the same that makes people want to come back and, and for more because that's how I feel.

Yeah, those bustling programs are always so exciting. I always picture, um, the events being so they're so great, but then also coming around the food and building the community and talking to each other is always, it feels so great. You do feel like you're around a group of friends and I wish I got to go to more programs.

Um, so okay. Speaking of programs, uh, Debbi, do you have a favorite experience or workshop or memory of WOWNet you'd be willing to share with us? Um, Tiffany did this one and Tiff remind me, I don't remember what year it was. We were at this camp that this couple had bought this camp and you gotta go spend the night and, um, uh, retreat.

The retreat. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Like, I, uh, I just remember that, I mean, I just remember a lot of that, um, and that was like just, it was, it was kind of, it was just so unique to be with women, you know, that you've never met before and now you're like in these, uh, cabins with them and you get up in the morning and you have your little breakfast thing going down and, and then you have a guest speaker.

But a couple of the guest speakers that I remember specifically because they changed, they really changed my, um, direction of where I was going. And one of them was this gal and Tiff, you'll remember her name because she literally went on to be kind of famous in the world of forestry. But her and this guy started the whole forestry education thing that in for fire.

And that literally became, where I got involved was like Firewise. Oh, Carrie, Carrie Berger it. Yeah. Right. And so, and Daniel. Yeah. Right, exactly. And they shared their story about fire and ,um, creating safety where you live in your neighborhood, and Carrie gives this very personal story about it. Mm-hmm. And then it goes on and they were just, uh, writing the curriculum, right?

The curriculum hadn't been published yet and they were telling us about, um, you know, fire in communities. Well, this was kind of, you know, this was like not necessarily the hot topic yet in Oregon. Yeah. I mean, this was, had been kind of happening in California while they were coming out and talking to us about this.

And so it really made me rethink about fire and rethink about, um, my direction I was gonna take our property at that time, our Christmas tree property. So there was that guest speaker, and then there was this other guest speaker who talked about what do you do when you die? Mm-hmm. How do you will your property?

Who gets your property? And then what do you want for those people? Do you want them just to chop down all your trees and build houses? You know, what did, what was your vision that didn't quite get completed while you were alive, right? And so, um, I literally went home and I started diving into what's called a management plan.

And I think even then they sent links. And then further, when we did the, um, master of Woodlands, uh, you know, program, I mean, we dove in really hard to that, but that became two life changers for me. Mm-hmm. Was thinking about my property for fire. And then, um, what is my management plan? What, what if I died?

What if I didn't even make it home from that conference? Would my girls even know what I was trying to do? I mean, I was really working hard at making the neighbors know, 'cause I was doing, um, like little summer camps and outings with kids on my property and I had like little stations and every time you went, you know, Christmastime wasn't just like, come get a tree, you know?

By golly they were gonna learn how old that tree was. How long, you know now that just tree that's gonna show up in your house for two weeks took me 12 years to grow. And, uh, sweet darling, we got some education to do. So, um, that's amazing. Yeah. Right. And so, uh, yeah, so that was an event that was, you know, really monumental for me and changing my direction of thinking.

I love that. I think that was actually a conversation that we had about like, what were people's biggest fears around management and um, yes, that's what I was trying to get at was the, the dying piece without just going for it directly. Because that is something that, that does tend to come out in, in the research that women are more interested in, more worried about, more willing to talk about than, than like their husbands often or their dads or whatever are.

Um, and, but it's really hard to get people to talk about that. And so, yeah, I, I, that was also monumental to me 'cause I was terrified 'cause I led that discussion. So I'm so happy to hear that it had that kind of a impact on you because I was just like, oh my goodness, this could go so bad. And, but that's part of the thing that I love about WOWNet.

It is just like, even if I, like, I could try something like that and, and you all will be accepting of it or, or be receiving of it, even if it doesn't go like I was hoping or like it was planned or whatever and, and that that whole conversation didn't go exactly like I, you know, dreamed it up in my brain.

But it was beautiful and it was, it was natural and organic and that's what I was hoping for. I have got to ask you, Tiff, you gotta remember this Wownet thing. This was crazy talk these two sisters, okay? We were having all these fires on the east side and it was a WOWNet deal. And these two sisters show up and they had inherited this property over by Jefferson.

I don't know. Um, I it has to be. It was either OSWA or it was WOWNet. And they talked about how they had never even walked the property of their, it was like their dad's or their grandpa's property and they lived in California and they had to come up and start working with the... was that WOWNet? Or maybe it was a side conversation, but it was crazy to think, um, and they were super inspired to start getting involved with their property and then this fire hit.

Mm-hmm. You know, I mean, you guys remember when that whole Jefferson area burned up? It was over, um, Sisters, Jefferson, Bend, maybe three years ago, four years ago. Anyways, um, I just remember them going, "Why didn't we do this sooner?" "Why didn't we walk our property sooner?" Why they, and what it was is they were gonna retire in California, these two sisters, and then come move into, you know, move to Oregon and, you know, start really looking at their, uh, grandpa's property.

It was, it was ridiculous too. They own like 1300 acres or something. It was like big piece of property. Yeah. And they'd never even been there. And now it was on fire. Mm-hmm. Right. And now they had to make some really critical decisions about what was gonna burn and what should they try to save. And there was like this old cabin on the property.

Do you remember this? Yes. Yeah, it was, I think it was a mixture. It was at that same retreat. It was, um, the, because the, did they have maps and stuff of it? Yes, maps, yeah. Daniel and Carrie were just like going nuts 'cause they had been directly impacted by that fire. And it was, it was before we all had.

Very, not all, but so many of us had directly felt the impacts of fire. And so the fact that they had been directly affected by this fire and had the maps and all this stuff, Daniel and Carrie were just totally nerding out. So we had a big conversation about that. But then, then I think during that other conversation they kind of brought some more of like the personal feelings and stuff around it.

Yeah. Yeah. I'm so glad I didn't just dream that up, but it was a nightmare I had. Yeah, it was so real though. Yeah. Your stories just gimme chills, you know, thinking about just like the real life situations that you're able to address and just work through together, work together in just real time that people are afraid to address in any other settings.

It's so wonderful that this program exists and mm-hmm. That you're able to, you know, meet those needs and address really important serious topics and, um, make it through the other side. It's so, so great to hear. So, um, Debbi, do you have anything else that you wanted to share about WOWNet or Tiffany? Um, before we, um, so moving to this new community, Halfway or Pine Valley.

Um, I got ahold of Tiff because she's my favorite person to get ahold of, to bring people together. And a couple, I don't know, was it, it was right when I moved here, right Tiff? I literally had started the Firewise program here, Pine Valley, Firewise Community, and I saw that people were hungry coming outta Covid to meet.

And fires is just like that neutral topic, right? So we have like 250 people that live in our WUI area, which is the wildland urban interface. So they, and these are what, um, a lot of them would even call themselves. Um, I don't know, they're old hippies or they're one, do they call 'em Muffin? I don't know.

Whatever. Muffin, muffin, mushroom, muffin people, I don't know. Whatever they wanna call themselves. And they bought their property a long time ago. They wanted to retire, you know, in the middle of nowhere. And literally, like some of 'em have been here bought their property 30 years ago, but have only moved here like five or six years ago, right?

And these are homes way stuffed up into the woods. Well, um, starting the Firewise community, uh, it literally, it wasn't that difficult because these people were nervous about where they lived. They knew enough to know they were in a hotspot. Um, our woods on this north Wall hasn't been on fire for 90 years.

Um, so when I kind of started this conversation and started bringing people together, what I noticed was, again, it wasn't the men that were asking the questions, it was the women. It was the women wanted to know, how do I protect our home? How do I protect the structure? What do I look for? What's a diseased tree?

What's not a diseased tree? Um, you know, like, what can I do? And here where we live in Pine Valley, it is a do it yourself program. These people are do it yourself people. They don't go hire people to help. Right. If you move here, you better put your boots on and get ready to, like, for my husband and I build our house.

Like literally, I'm not kidding. I can't believe we're still married. And so, um... congratulations. Yeah. That's the own topic of success. Yeah. So, uh, the, the thing was about, um, so I got a hold of Tiff 'cause I'm like, I'm like, Tiff, we gotta do a program here. And she's like, well, what do you wanna do it on? And I'm like, making it up, right?

Because I hadn't been here that long, but I'm like, let's do it on mapping and compassing, right? That's just another thing where I have always found women are shy of, or we don't, we're not as, we don't have the same aptitude, you know, to, uh, like, I mean, go figure. You're with your husband in your car and you're like, well, look at the map.

Look at the directions. I know how to get there. I don't need to, you know, stop telling me where to go. I know how to get there. Like, right. Always. We've had these conversations for a hundred years, they always know how to get there and we're always the ones looking at a map going, no, but the directions say, you know?

Right. It's just the way it is. So, um, we finally, she bless her heart, uh, so we endured the whole Covid thing and she was able to come this year. And I had a lot of women on board. But honestly, even out of the dozen women that did show up for the Compassing Map event up in the Cornucopia Mountains, um, I know there was a ton more, but because it's new to them, right?

So now, now Tiff's planted this seed where, you know, and those people went home and told a bunch of people, and now they're part of Tiffany's Google, you know, network where Tiff goes, you know, she sends information out and YouTube's out, uh, book clubs out, uh, events, out all this stuff. Now they can start to feel more a part of it.

So if she was able to come next year, it would double in size, right? Because that whole thing, um, about coming for the first time is breaking down those first walls of will I be judged? How uncomfortable will I be? Um, how, you know, was it really worth carving out that time out of my busy ranching, you know, farming schedule, whatever schedule it is.

And so she's always done a great job of that first time experience being professional, um, onboard, highly communicated, and, you know, so then, you know, she does all that work, but then you just gotta get people there. And then once they get to that first one, because it's so well organized and thought through, boom, they're in.

Mm-hmm. Right. So I just like, I know it would double if she was to, you know, be able to come out here in, in the toolies, uh, again, uh, just because of that experience these ladies had. Yeah, that's such a good, um, that is what I would want to say. I guess like if anybody is listening that's like hungry for WOWNet, Debbi did all of that.

Like I, I like to call these spark plugs and they're rare, few and far in between, but, um, just because she was able to rally some women a handful really, you know, like Jake, the local forestry natural resource extension agent out there and myself were floored that 12 women came in Halfway, Oregon to this event 'cause we were like, we'll be happy with six or so because yeah, it's a brand new thing.

Nobody's heard of it and it's intimidating and um, so yeah, I just think if there's any, a woman out there who's like, I want this in my neck of the woods. Then yeah, just reach out and, and I'll do my darnedest because like if there's five women who are like, I need WOWNet in my life, then I'm like, Hey, let's make that happen because I don't wanna leave anybody without it.

It feels like such an important resource to me to share with people that will just do what we can to, to make it happen. And I think like at that workshop we, those women were like, what? Oh man, I wish so-and-so would've came. Oh, I'm definitely gonna invite so-and-so next time. And, and that's how it works.

And it snowballs from there. And you get a good group of ladies who will always come no matter what. And you can always know if you put on a wound thing that these 12 people will come and hopefully bring a friend or a neighbor or something. And I think that is something that's really beautiful about extension as a whole is like, then if it's, if, if you, Debbi, are inviting a neighbor, that person feels so much more safe and comfortable to come to this workshop because they have you.

And, and as for specifically WOWNet, if you are going to another workshop, you can reach out to your WOWNet ladies and be like, Hey, I'm going to this workshop so we can be our own little safe space in this larger workshop. Um, and, and so then it kind of empowers women to help each other go to these other things also and feel safe 'cause they have a friendly face.

And so, yeah, I think that's, that's really cool. I, I thought it was kind of funny because randomly my dad was at that workshop, um, and Jake, so these two dudes and my dad afterwards was like, it's kind of weird because all these ladies brought flowers to talk about and.

Debbi cried during that. I cried during that. I was like, I asked the women to bring a piece of their property, something small from their property that they could share. And we did these introductions and it was just like so beautiful and so pure and just a lot of them brought flowers. And I was like, that's not weird.

That's, that's what makes these people different. Like they didn't bring DBH tape to be like, oh yeah, that's how I measure my trees. It is like just such a beautiful moment and experience and I'm like looking back there and I love Jake, but you know, like he's looking through something and my dad's like, that was kind of weird.

And I was like, that was so beautiful. You guys are weird.

Goes to show you how different we are. Yeah. Yeah. So, Tiffany, you talked a lot about, um, women who might be interested about joining WOWNet or craving this experience from listening to the podcast. Can you, you said to get ahold of you, can you give them a little bit more information about, about that? How do they join up?

Or join up that sounds like bad. It's not a cult. How do you, you know, how do they get in contact with you or, um, learn about where these events are happening? Okay, so if, if, if there's anybody listening that's interested in, in learning more about WOWNet, that's like a, a good first step. It's, um, extension.Oregonstate.edu/WOWNet, that's our website. Um, and there's just a little bit of information. There's a, a nice little video you can watch and then some resources, some learning resources that are really awesome that I've specifically chosen for maybe that would be of more interest to female landowners. Um, and then, yeah, if you want to join WOWNet is free.

There's no like membership fees or anything. It's really. From my perspective about meeting you where you're at. So if you read about, you join the listserv, so it's just a mailing list and it, and then I send out all the workshops and whatever. And if you read about one that you're like, I wanna go to that, you can sign up.

If it's not of interest to you, there's like no pressure to come or anything like that. And maybe, you know, a lot of women are, are busy, are raising children, whatever. It might just be that you're receiving the emails and that's enough for you. And a lot of the times, like the newsletter, I just pack it full of resources and, and then try to send out opportunities as they come.

But it's about a once a month email or so, um, it's kind of maybe like on average. And yeah, that's, that's pretty much it. So, um, yeah. Well, so good to hear from you all about your amazing experiences with WOWNet. Um, don't leave us yet. Uh, we have a lightning round to ask you some little bit more personal questions.

Okay. So, um, before the end of each episode, we do a lightning round where we ask our guests a few final questions. Um, we'll start with Tiffany. So Tiffany, what's your favorite tree? Um, my favorite tree is a Douglas fir, I think a classic 'cause I was born and raised in, in Oregon, so I grew up amongst the Doug firs. I have a giant tattoo of one on, on my back.

Awesome. Popular tree on this podcast. Oh, I bet. Okay. So what's the most interesting thing that you bring with you out into the field, whether it's in a cruiser vest or a field kit, or any type of bag you like to bring out with you? I was, I, I was thinking. Something a little bit more unique. And then like, as you were asking that, I was like, oh, something super morbid that I bring is baby aspirin.

I like to specifically to workshops because I'm always afraid that something bad is gonna happen and someone's gonna have a heart attack. So I keep baby aspirin in my pocket. Well, you gotta be safe. Yeah. Yeah. I, I don't know why heart attacks in the woods just scare me. Um, but yeah, and my, my husband's a paramedic, so I'm just always kind of thinking in those ways, I guess.

Um, but yeah, maybe less morbid I think I bring like a sense of wonder. I feel like that's such a cheesy answer to that question, but I'm always like on the lookout for little things that I can just like, I don't know, like a little pine cone I could bring back to my boys and show them and like dissect it and stuff.

I, I just feel like that is something that I don't see most of my colleagues doing or, or looking at the woods in those ways. Or I'll like pick up little caterpillars and help them cross the road when I'm walking or the trail, or if something's dead in the trail like a worm, I like give it a little burial or whatever.

So I think just like this, I, I always bring to the woods with me some kind of sense of like wonder and wanting to explore in this, like looking at the tiny little details, I guess. Yeah. That's great. Okay. And then lastly, what resources would you recommend to our listeners if they're interested in learning more about women owning Woodlands or other, um, female empowerment programs in the woods or forests?

So I was thinking like if you are a female landowner and you're looking for resources, obviously somehow you've been connected with Extension. So hopefully that's the first place I direct Ladies is like their local extension agent. But then also my favorite resource online is the, um, Know Your Forest Learning Library.

And that to me is such an approachable resource for people. And then also now the Tree School online. Um, the, the webinars that are there for people to access, those are now my two favorite resources that I direct ladies to. Yeah, those are, those are amazing resources and it's always great to, um, put those, remind people of those and, and share those out.

So Debbi, I'm excited to hear your, um, answers. Um, do you wanna share with us what your favorite tree is? Well, uh, my favorite evergreen tree on the east side would be the Ponderosa. Um, I like the Ponderosa for a lot of reasons, but one reason, um, that I'm really in favor of it now is it tends to be kind of fire resistant.

It has a nice thick bark on it, right? Um, and it grows here naturally, right? So when we bought our property of 17 acres, I ordered 2000 trees. And, uh, even though we didn't plant out all in the whole orchard part, or not the orchard, but the pasture part of it, I'll tell you, those little ponderosa trees that I got, you know, for 50 cents a piece are now, oh gosh, at least.

On average 18 to 24 inches each. And so they love growing here, right. So it's super important, I think, um, to obviously plant what grows there naturally, but I have, I've come to love them. And so, uh, yeah, now that's my favorite tree on the east side. It's a good one, especially when you get to smell their bark when it starts.

Mm-hmm. Okay. So what's the most interesting thing that you bring with you in the field in a cruiser vest or a field kit or your truck? I am a notebook person, so taking notes. I love to take notes and I love to take pictures, and I know that's not super interesting, um, but I just do, I'm just constantly always writing down things or drawing little pictures of what I see.

And, um, it just, it helps me remember. So I always have like a little notebook with me. Great. I always forget things. So notebooks are great to help you remember too. Okay. And then did you have anything that you wanted to share, a resource that, um, you could recommend to our listeners if they wanted to learn more about WOWNet or forestry in general?

Yeah, I wanna piggyback on what Tiff said. Um, and that was the Woman Owning Woodlands there's a national site. And so this is, I mean this is like so wonderful for Oregon, but just know this isn't just Oregon, right? This is a national organization. And I, um, and when I learned that, that it made it even more exciting for me 'cause I felt, oh wow.

I'm even more connected, you know? Um, another one that I love was, uh, was OFRI, which kinda um, went into what's called oregonforests.org. And I love that for, uh, kids, families, and teachers. I also love the, um, group that's called Organ Natural Resource, uh, Education Programs. Is that right, TIFF? It's ONREP Oregon.

It's with LeeAnn. Yeah, so ONREP has one that's amazing. So if you are an educator and you wanna get involved, um, and know more about forests, that's another super good one, like the Oregonforests.org. And I, uh, totally piggyback on Tiffs, you know, know your Forest. That's just lovely. And then as far as organizations, um, you do not have to own trees to be involved with Oregon Small Woodlands Association.

It is an association for people who love trees. You know, if you have one tree and you care about that tree, um, you know, I would just say it's, it's super, it's a very reasonable organization to join. You get a walk on people's properties and learn about what they're doing, and you get to hear from all ages of people and all experiences of people who love the woods.

So I would do a shout out for OSWA, and there's one in every county in this state of Oregon.

So as you were listening today, if any questions came up or we didn't cover a specific topic related to women owning Woodlands or peer learning programming, um, feel free to drop us a comment or send us a message on our website at inthewoodspodcast.org and we'll try to cover it in a future episode.

Welcome to In the Woods ladies. Hey, Lauren. Thanks. This is gonna be such a fun episode. Um, I'm hoping that at the end of this podcast, listeners have a really good idea about what programs are available at Oregon State University and, um, how useful and amazing it is to have a program that empowers female forest landowners.

But before we dive in, I'd like to get to know our guests a little bit more. Theresa, can you tell me a little bit more about yourself? Well, I'm married to Kate and, uh, Kate and I became kind of unexpected small woodland owners in 2019. And, um, before that she had been a teacher. I'd worked in a nursery and before that, we'd both been ministering in impoverished communities.

So this has been a real, um, one could say pivot in, in direction, um, or in some ways it's also going back to much older roots. Great, Kate? Well, T took part of that over for me, which is actually good. Um, but having been a teacher, one of the things that happened for us right away was knowing that what we needed to do was find people who knew more than we did because we knew just enough to know that we loving the woods didn't mean we knew anything about taking care of a woodland.

So, that led us pretty quickly to the extension and actually to you. Yes, I'm grateful to have you in my area and be able to work with you often. Well, thank you so much for telling everybody, um, about your experience. Can you tell us a little bit more now about why you joined WOWNet? Oh wow. It, um, well, certainly we, we wanted to get to know people who knew more than we did.

And to be fair, you pretty much couldn't shake a stick without hitting somebody who knew more than we did. It is Oregon. It's Oregon after all. But somewhere along the line, it may have been doing research on like chainsaw safety or something. We, but somewhere along the line we, we found WOWnet and went wow.

A group of women doing this, that, that would be awesome. And that's not to say anything bad about any of the men who are so good about teaching us things and being gentle with us, but the idea of a group of women, it, it's just different. And I think sometimes we share experiences and, and just relate differently.

And so that was really exciting. Okay, so, um, it's great that WOWNet offers, you know, those opportunities where you can be around women who are doing similar things and there's just this different dynamic than maybe multi-gender and program, other multi-gender programs. Um, so is, are there other reasons why this group is important to you or specifically for your own experience?

You know, I think actually how it became important to us is like so many things in owning our woodland, um, is actually about the fires. Um, because there was one of the online, um, WOWNet retreats pretty much three days after we'd been allowed back onto the property after the holiday farm fire. And I remember there was a gentleness to everyone.

Certainly starting with Tiffany. I mean, you were actually one of the most gentle. I mean, you were a wonderfully gentle presence, even just running the, the virtual retreat. But you started talking to us and I think we needed somebody that gentle. I mean, that was a really devastating experience to have a Woodland and 18 months later pretty much have lost it.

Mm-hmm. Um, and I, so somehow I think that cemented our sense of relationship, both with WOWNet and certainly with, you know, our WOWNet Director. There's some really good women in there. And I think you, you, we started out with something as an idea. But then relationships evolve out of that too. Um, relationships, experiences, so, you know, doing that, that online retreat.

And we are not people persons. I mean, I know people think we're, but we're really not. If we're given a choice between going out and doing something with people and staying at our place, we will usually want to choose to stay at our place. But there've been some, some really awesome relationships forged, even online.

And I think that the quality of those relationships and the, the quality of the programming, But also knowing that the programming's gonna be receptive to, to shifts in mood or personnel, I think that's had a lot to do with just how much a part of things WOWNets become for us. Yeah, that sort of plays into, um, what you said earlier about, you know, that it's those relationships and the content and almost that connection to being a woman as well.

So like, you know, um, how this might affect you as a woman using this tool because your body shape or size or strength is how it is, which it could be different than how a man would use it or somebody else. So yeah, it's kinda cool how the program just takes into consideration all those things. And, and nobody has to feel bad because they don't want the biggest chainsaw possible because that's just a lot of extra weight to be hauling around.

And why are you doing that? And, and it's not a matter of, oh, my saws bigger than yours. I mean, so what do you find really effective? And, well, I have a couple and, and you can, it's really fun to talk about tools and, and it's okay to say that, well, I just don't like hauling this around. It's not worth the weight.

And I know I could find myself in a co-ed group kind of going, I can haul that. Now, I mean, that's my own failure, but..

But it is fun to be able to talk about those things. Like where did you find a pair of gloves that actually fit and lasted and, you know, weren't, didn't have to be pink? Or where did you find a good pair? Come on. I love pink. But I don't. Okay, fair enough. After, after it's been in the woods a while, it's gonna be brown anyway.

But you know how to speak the truth. Yeah. And actually it's not like the gloves that I love the most aren't like some light shade of gray, so, you know, and then brown. But it is fun to be able to talk about, you know, what pants work or hey, these pants have pockets and they last and they can go through blackberries and they still fit you and you don't feel like a block.

Yeah. You know, you still feel like you're a girl. Um, but it's fun to be able to have folks to talk, have those conversations with, um, or you, yeah 'cause it's harder, you know, guys go, oh yeah, well this just fits. It's like, yeah, but what if it doesn't, you know, or how do you find good cork boots or some of those things that are, that are tough to find if you are not, you know, six feet tall or whatever.

And we're so, definitely not any of those things. Yeah. I think at the chainsaw workshop that you both hosted, that was one of the things, it always is with WOWNet, like the equipment, the tools, the clothing and that stuff. As soon as that starts getting talked about, people are out with their pens and pencils and just like writing down whatever everyone else is recommending.

And you guys got out your chaps and were showing people and people were just like, oh, okay, what's the brand? And you know, so I feel like that it's, it's funny because that might not be something that people would think about as much. Um, but even like one of the people who has taught the chainsaw workshop, um, who is that?

I can't remember. But talking about like pulling your hair back and wearing like a supportive bra and just like making sure everything's, you know, not out and about and that can be dangerous. And that's like not something that you're talking about in a co-ed or, you know, male dominated chainsaw class, um, hair ties and bras.

So, yeah. Maybe we need to.

Well, and it's fun too 'cause you get to sort of geek out about your favorite tools and things, and I don't know that women would always talk up as loudly in a co-ed group about how much they love their particular tools or the things that they like to do. So, um, it's nice to have that space where it's also okay and you don't have to feel unfeminine because you do love your chainsaw or whichever your current favorite, you know, whichever your current, favorite tool is.

Whether it's, you know, oh, it's the Pulaski this week, or it's my, you know, my grubber this week. Or, you know, depending on what you're doing. You know, we love our tools too. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, I guess you sort of answered this question already because we've talked a lot about how this group is slightly different than other woodland owner groups, specifically when you get to talk about clothes and bras in class.

Um, but is there anything else that makes, you know, WOWNet a unique group to other woodland owner groups? Yeah, it's, um, and I'm not quite sure how to say this and, and, and not have it sound like I'm putting a negative spin on it, but it's in a way less purpose driven than some. So like we're members of OWIT, OWIT has a, has some pretty clear goals, and that's to support science-based forestry education in Oregon.

Okay, so there are different ways of doing that, but that, that's a real goal. And to get that word out there and with WOWNet, it's more about bringing women together, whether in person or virtually, to share and learn and network on things that are of concern or of interest. Um, and so, it and this is not to say anything against OWIT either 'cause we're really, really involved in OWIT, but they're different.

And, and I think it's great to have that difference. I think if folks wanted to, to really focus on, on educating the public or educating youth and found their way into WOWNet and found that that's not what we're doing, that would be frustrating and vice versa. And so I think having this, this space for us to be, and to share and to learn and to share the fruits of that learning and to share the fruits of other learning and to ask questions, it's, it's really a great space to have available to us.

Please speak wife. I say before you switch, before you switch over, for the benefit of our listeners, can you just explain what OWIT stands for? I'm sorry, Oregon Women in Timber. Um, founded in 1978, um, really to support science-based education and forest literacy in Oregon. Great. Thanks. Okay, wife, go ahead.

Speak. Actually, by now I've lost track of what the question was. I know I talk in circles like that. What makes WOWNet unique from other woodland owner groups? I think there's something about the networking piece that makes it something that can... yeah, can be so much more sort of flexible so that it, it can so depend on what the group is, whether 'cause you know, you, you don't have, you're not as driven by the pur a particular purpose.

Whether it's like, yes, with Oregon Women in Timber focusing on this education piece or even some of the small Woodlands groups that have, you know, it's all about, you know, fellowship and education and advocacy. WOWNet can actually be tailored to the group of women you have, um, and what they wanna be able to do.

So whether it's like, have a book club, which has actually been really fun to like, oh, let's read this book together and, you know, talk about it. And the magic of reading braiding sweetgrass is something you can't, um, replicate with every book. But I mean, that was really a wonderful kind of thing that you wouldn't assume any, that automatically a woodland owning group would be sort of focused on.

And so that's kind, that makes it kind of special. Or being able to bring people together that wouldn't automatically, you know, from chainsaws to wreath making, right? Um, that's kind of a wonderfully broad kind of thing that you can be doing that can be equally appealing. Mm-hmm. And I don't know that you do that in mixed gender groups in quite the same way.

Yeah, that's true. Those are some great, I know I would, I would take a class series that started with chainsaws and ended with wreath making.

But also having a group of people who are interested in both of those things and everything in between. Not that all women in WOWNet are, but yeah, it's just like this, it's, it makes it difficult to, to do programming because it's, yeah, you have some, there isn't as direct of a purpose or goal and you have some women who are like, yeah, I, I wanna learn about the chainsaws, the tools, the this on the ground.

Exactly this. And then you have some women who are like, I will never touch a chainsaw. I have no interest in utilizing a chainsaw. I'm not into that. And I would much rather, learn about mushrooms or, you know, whatever. Um, and so, for me, I've always looked at that as exciting because it's just like, okay, we get to do all of these different things and I try to just really figure it out, like what are the women of the network looking for and how can we just kind of switch things up each year to offer things that are gonna be applicable or interesting to different categories and.

But yeah, it's, it is funny, like in one year doing a, a mushroom workshop and a chainsaw safety workshop and a non-timber forest products, this and management plan. Yeah. It's always all over the place. That's, I think, part of what makes it wonderful. Um, the newsletter that's been coming out that you started Tiffany, during, especially when we were really all locked down, that's continued.

The, we're that we're all in this together, which I love the title as well, but that's been kind of awesome because that's, shown that whole breadth and scope of what WOWNet is all the way along 'cause it's never, you could never pin it down to being oh, about one particular thing. Um, so that everyone can kind of dive in and connect wherever, wherever the net, you know, wherever they wanna grab the bit of the net they can.

Nice. So I think that's, I mean, that's a really wonderful thing about WOWNet mm-hmm. And kudos to you for, for facilitating that because it would be much easier if the, the range of interests were narrower. But I think you do a great job of responding to that, that whole spectrum. And not everything is something everybody's interested in, but at least something's out there for you.

And I know that puts more work on you. But, um, thank you for doing that. Oh, thank you. Mm. Now that you've talked about all the, you know, adjoining features and things that are, that make WowNet so wonderful because it's sort of fluid, I'm gonna, you know, make you tell me the opposite of that and try to pick one thing that's your favorite thing or favorite part about WOWNet.

Really, you're gonna walk into that? 'Cause we can say that our favorite part of that is, is that huge spectrum of possibilities that it offers. Touche.

Actually, I think my fa one of my favorite parts has been the relationship that's grown, um, actually with a few of the women in WOWNet. But actually our sense of relationship with you, Tiffany, has been really a special, an incredibly special part of it to know that we can reach out to you if we have a, a random question or we need, you know, to be connected to another part of the net.

Um, or, oh, can, can we cheat and, and sit in on the master woodland manager mini college? We promise we won't say anything. And because there's a relationship, you know, we got to do that. Which made us feel more included in this sort of woodland owning community, but also made us feel really excited that we'd been listening in enough of our classes that we actually understood things we were hearing.

Um, but yeah, I'd say that's been one of, yeah, it's helped us feel more connected. Just kind of what a net should do too. I feel the same back, so I'm withholding my crying. So that's all I'm gonna say.

Well, speaking of favorites, um, so now that we talked about your favorite part about WOWNet, do you have a favorite experience or workshop or memory, um, related to, to WOWNet that you were willing to share with us? So here's kind of a weird one because we are not the actually craftsy hands-on. I mean, Tiffany's always amazing that she can do that.

But one of the things that, the first thing we did do was actually the wreath making workshop that Lauren, that you hosted. And now what was fun was actually the wreaths weren't horrible, um, that we made, which was fun. And, but actually the most fun we had was that it connected us by the end of that workshop 'cause we stayed around to help.

Um, clean up. Clean up afterwards. Which actually, I don't know if that should be my favorite, but it actually I appreciate it. It was, but it, it actually, that was the best part because we got to know one of the, you know, we got to know Wilda and Steve that way, so that made us feel more connected to our small woodland owner group in our county.

But it also really connected us, you know, so with with Wilda who's, you know, been, she's been her own sort of through line thread of our experience of, of WOWNet too. So that, you know, in the trenches kind of getting, having those opportunities to connect in, in the way you're best at, which for us actually always has been the cleanup afterwards.

Um, but that often is how we feel most connected is like, oh, if you're able to work in the trenches beside somebody, you know, as something as small as cleanup. Although it can feel pretty big if you're the only one left to clean up. So feeling welcomed, that made us feel more welcome and made us wanna do more things with WOWNet.

Mm-hmm. Do you have one? I was think I had this moment last night at book club looking at the screens and it's like, wow. I, I know all these women. Mm-hmm. And you know, some of them I know only through a screen because we've done book club together, but others I've gotten to know even more through that screen than I would if I only saw them at say, OSWA events.

Mm-hmm. And, um, and that was really cool. Just this, you know, over what a three year period we have gotten to know people. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. WOWNets mattered enough to us that, you know, we left the property to go, to, go to like the, over when there was the actual retreat, you know, we actually left and you know, fire season was mostly done, but Septembers are scary times by now.

And we were willing to, you know, leave and drive to the not the other end of the state. But it's not like it's that big a state, but you know, to drive, to go be away for a weekend because we wanted to hang out with other, other WOWNet women and with Tiffany. So, and that was actually and learn more at the same time.

That was the best kind of retreat. Like, ooh, it's like class, every few hours there's a new class. And two things to learn and no offense, or again, at not being that big a state. It wasn't meant insultingly.

Yeah, that's really cool. The about getting to know people. I feel like specifically with the book club, because it's so many consecutive meetings where people are, if they came to the first one, then they're continuing to come and it's been a definite continuation from the first group. Right. So I was noticing that last night too, like there's a banter and people have just grown to feel much more comfortable kind of.

Giving little teases or asking like a follow-up question like you said this and can you expand, you know, or whatever. And I don't that, that wasn't happening at the very beginning of the book club. And so that's really cool, um, to see from my perspective to it. It's really special because like you said, if even over the course of the retreat, that definitely happens.

But then it's like you might not see those women in for two years at the next retreat 'cause if you're in totally different parts of the state, and that was one of the beautiful things about the book club that, oh, this is gonna be an opportunity besides the retreat that can feel not attainable for a lot of women.

Um, it's gonna be an opportunity to bring women from all over the state together. Uh, and so yeah, that's been, pretty special but not anticipated outcome, I guess, is like really building relationships and the depth of the conversations. Like you really get into stuff that you would not get into at a normal workshop.

As hard as I might try to drag out those like emotion based responses, it just never really happens. It doesn't happen organically and can't force it, and this has been so organic and so not forced. So that definitely helps in building those relationships, and I love that because now when you see that person at a workshop that's already in existence and that's so cool.

Yeah, and it's, it's, it's, sorry, go ahead Lauren. Nope. It's, it's been awesome because I mean, I've certainly heard of women's book clubs where nobody reads the book. You just go and gossip and drink wine and it's like, oh, or I could shoot myself. And, um, but this has been really deep conversation and, and you know, more purpose driven than say the WOWNet overarching purpose.

But, so if you don't want that, you don't join book club. And clearly there are people who don't join book club. And, and there are these great conversations that happen because we're discussing things that matter, um, in a deep way. And then you get to that point in the conversation where the book isn't even as important as the questions and the conversation, it kicks off.

Mm-hmm. Yeah. And that has been one of those odd byproducts of, you know, moving into this Zoom universe, that it is pretty wonderful that we can sit in the comfort of our own homes and like not have to leave our woodlands and yet be able to connect with other woodland owning women in the comfort of their own living rooms.

And I, I think that has that and your sort of gentle facilitation of those conversations, um, and relationships has helped us forge deeper relationships and have those deep conversations that are about the woods, but al are also about the world. Um, yeah, that's, yeah, it's so, so true. Most Zoom stuff is like, oh man, another Zoom.

That one I'm like, yes. I'm so excited. And it's crazy because on Zoom we've struggled so much as facilitators, especially Extension. That's one of the goals is to like really have people participating and feel comfortable asking questions and how can I apply this to my specific property? And on Zoom, it's hard to get people to unmute and to engage in a way that that we were able to do easily in, in, in-person events.

And, and so I was terrified 'cause I was like, this is gonna be just me sitting up here having a conversation with myself while all these women stare at me, um, on Zoom. I was, but we're gonna try it. We're going to try it. And, and it's been actually the exact opposite of, of that.

Um, so yeah. And I think like one of the questions last night about like the camping and people that wanna go, camping, um, and see other people. And we were like, ew, why would you wanna see other people camping? And we were like, oh, this is one of those things that's probably unique to people who own Woodlands.

And so there is this very much, um, like tie through that it's like, well, yeah, we can all relate on this different level that a, a normal, normal group of women gathering to do a book club, it wouldn't have that through line where it's like, yeah, and we're all woodland owners and can kind of talk about these things in a different capacity.

So that's pretty cool. But yeah, such a unexpected, like my, just my favorite thing that I've ever done in WOWNet. So. Yeah, it really speaks to the power of peer learning programs because it's just a way that you subconsciously break down those walls and barriers between the other people in class and you can really get deep conversations about whatever the topic is and how that relates to your own personal experience.

It's pretty cool and we don't see it pretty, uh, very often at other woodland owner groups because you just don't have that ability to engage with people as much. It's really cool and it's a wonderful experience to be part of one of those programs. I don't get to do go to all of them, but the ones I do get to are, are some of my favorite.

So, um, is there anything else about WOWNet that you'd like to share or that you love or hate? Hate or..

How rude.

But I think WOWNets one of those things that women who own a woodland are part of owning a woodland, I mean, there are more and more things that are coming out that there are more and more women that are woodland owners. Mm-hmm. And, um, whether they're woodland owners with, you know, a male partner or on their own or they've inherited a property.

And I think the power of recognizing that, supporting women as really important in this whole venture of caring for forests for the long term. Um, like the wom, the Women's Forest Congress, the fir, the initial one just was these past few days. And I think the power of bringing women together and finding these, and we have found a number of different groups of, of women to be, um, a part of.

And I think there, there's just something really important about them because they're safe spaces to be challenged to learn and to be about something bigger than just your own property, to actually know that you're part of something that's about caring for, you know, caring for a piece of the planet that's, you know, an inter that's interlocked into many other pieces of the planet.

And I think there's just something really important and valuable about having it exist. Um, and yeah, I think all women who own Woodlands should be a part of WOWNet. Without being prescriptive, of course, without being prescriptive about it. But yeah, I agree wholeheartedly without being prescriptive about it.

Well, what a wonderful way to close out our conversation about WOWNet. Thank you so much for joining me today. Oh, thank you, Lauren. Thanks for having us. Yeah. Yes, thank you. Don't leave us yet. We have our lightning round up next.

So what's your favorite tree? Oh, please forgive me all my precious Dougs, but probably a Coast Redwood. You know, that might be the first time I've heard it on the podcast, so surprisingly. Very nice. And I'm thinking at this very moment, I'm loving the Pacific Madrone. Oh, that's a good one. Yeah. But more apologies to all of our Dougs on the property.

Yes. My answer was the Doug fir, so I got you. We get a lot of Doug fir, although Hemlocks are kind of awesome too. Yeah. And actually I always go talk to our little baby grands 'cause they're the ones that, and I always think of Lauren when I go, oh, little Grand, look at you.

That, I don't think I've told this story on the podcast before, but when I was in graduate school, I TA'd a class on, I don't know, it was like Pacific Northwest Forest or something like that. And I led a field trip around the campus IDing trees. And um, I told the undergrad students that the grand, I was showing everyone a grand fir.

And I said, oh, this was named after my great-great-great-great grandfather, and they all believed me. And I was like, no, I'm just making that up. But how cool would it be? So I love that. I was at gullible too, so when I was a freshman. But I do think of you every time I see our grand fir, and especially because right now they're some of the ones that are still surviving.

Which, you know, these last couple of years have not actually been easy. So that they're surviving is pretty cool. Badass little trees. All right. Okay. Well what about the most interesting thing that you like to bring into the woods with you? Um, whether it's in a vest or a field kit or your pocket?

My sword. Your sword. You'll have to elaborate on that one. Which isn't really a sword, but you know, as, as you age. Well, as I age, I have trouble finding words sometimes. And so her sword is actually a foldable saw. But there was one day I wanted to make sure she had the saw with her and I'm like, okay, I know this is the wrong word, but the only word I can come up with is sword.

And so by now we always like, so do you have your sword with you? That's incredible. Definitely more fun. Yeah, if you can't beat'em join them. I don't know if it's a fun thing I always carry, but I'm always trying to bring my felcos with me because we went on a walk once with another woodland woman, Woodland owner, Lindsay Reaves, and watched her pull out clippers about 15 times to go after, you know, blackberries on the side of the road.

And so by now when we go for a walk, I try to make sure I have my sword in one pocket and my felcos in another pocket in case we need to. And I'm usually going after thistles, um, in case there are thistles I need to cut down. Nice. I dunno if that's an interesting thing. It's just something we always have, but it's a good tip.

Yeah. And we actually did, um, interview Lindsay on a previous podcast, so if there's any listeners that are interested in learning about Lindsay's objectives on her property. I think she also mentions her pruning shears and how she brings them out on all the walks. So, yeah. Um, okay. And then the last question that we ask is, um, do you have any resources that you would recommend to our listeners if they wanted to dive a little bit deeper into peer education or women owning woodlands or just landowner education in general?

Well, my first thought, and what we always say to people is, have you checked out extension? Um, which you didn't ask for that sort of plug, but I mean, we say, have you talked to your extension forester? And I mean, I think we always are pushing people in that direction between extension and OFRI, um, to go check out the Oregon Forest Resources Institute website 'cause there are amazing resources there.

But for the peer-to-peer extension and then small woodlands. Hmm. Yeah, yeah. Check out your local Small Woodlands chapter. But, but with extension and OFRI I don't even know that in a lifetime you could get through all of the resources available. Um, it, it, it's astounding.

I, I think we thought we'd gone to heaven when we discovered those websites. Mm-hmm. And with all of the tree school online, um, recordings as well. I mean, you can do an awful lot of learning without having to leave your living room. Because I'd say leave your forest, but you kind of have to be inside to have the uh, internet connection, the internet connection to watch them.

Otherwise you could go do it in the woods. Yeah. Yeah. We've done that. We've done, we've done classes on our phones in the woods. We have actually.

That's awesome. Power of technology. Exact same to resources that I refer people to when people just randomly email me about WOWNet or MWM. That's the first thing I say, like, have you talked to your local forestry and natural resources extension agent and here's the OFRI webpage, the Know Your Forest Learning Library 'cause I'm like, that's gonna be your two biggest sources of information and I'll help you as much as I can.

But yeah. I mean, this doesn't have to be part of a recording, but, um, one of the things we did with, like, we had a new neighbor who we knew as a new Woodland owner, and I actually sent him to our local Small, uh, Woodlands Association webpage, but I sent him to the specific page that's resources because it has all of those things listed.

So, you know, it has Lauren on it and it has extension overall and it has WOWNet, and it has, OWIT and it has OFRI and OSWA and all of those different resources because Oregon's amazingly fortunate in having this wealth of resources for small woodland owners and... true... all you have to do is take advantage of them.

Mm-hmm. Very true. Well, it's so wonderful to have all you ladies on the podcast. It's great to hang out with a group of women, even if it's virtual. Um, thank you so much again for joining me today, and thank you so much to our listeners. That concludes our episode about Women Owning Woodlands. And, um, join us in a couple weeks to explore another topic about Oregon's amazing Forests.

Until then, what's in your woods?

Thank you so much for listening. Show notes with links mentioned on each episode are available on our website inthewoodspodcast.com.

We would love to hear from you. Visit the tell us what you think, tab on our website to leave us a comment, suggest a guest or topic or ask a question that can be featuredin a future episode, and also give us your feedback by filling out our survey.

In the Woods was created by Lauren Grand, Jacob Putney, Carrie Berger, Jason O'Brienand Stephen Fitzgerald, who are all members of the Oregon State University Forestry and Natural Resources Extension Team.

Episodes are edited and produced by Kellan Soriano.Music for In the Woods was composed by Jeffrey Hino.

And graphic design was created by Christina Friehauf. We hope you enjoyed the episode,and we can't wait to talk to you again next month. Until then, what's in your woods?