178- Anna Ashby and Amber Reece - 10 beekeeping questions you were too afraid to ask (in English)

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:00:00] During the pandemic there's been intense interest in new things you can do at home. New hobbies, maybe playing the guitar or running your first compost. Beekeeping is certainly in that list. There's a lot of new beekeepers who are taking up beekeeping. They ordered the equipment and maybe they've ordered the bees and then they're faced with, "Oh, this is quite complicated."

In this episode, I have invited to the very first master level beekeepers, Anna Ashby and Amber Reese. They were the first beekeepers to achieve this master level here in Oregon Master Beekeeping Program. And they're going to devote this episode to the 10 most common questions they get from people who are just starting out.

So if you're just starting out in beekeeping, this episode is for you. So without further ado this week on PolliNation, the most common beginner beekeeping questions with Anna Ashby and Amber Reese, master beekeeper, extraordinaires.

This is a great episode. We're going to have the two first graduated Master Beekeepers in Oregon on the show. So let me just welcome. Welcome, Amber.

Amber Reece: [00:02:04] Thank you for having me.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:02:06] And thanks for joining us, Anna.

Anna Ashby: [00:02:09] Thank you for having me as well.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:02:11] Okay. So what we've done is, you guys as Master Beekeepers, master level beekeepers, are really responsible for very high level advice to all sorts of beekeepers, including beginner, beekeepers.

And I thought in this episode, we'd really focus on common questions that you both have gotten from beginner beekeepers. And Amber, I want to start with you, and both of you submitted questions to me in advance. These are questions that you have heard. And so the first question is: a beginner beekeeper, and they come to you and they say, "what species of honeybee should I start with?"

Amber Reece: [00:02:48] Yeah, that's a very common question that I get asked numerous times when I'm out doing presentations. And basically there are two main types of bees or races that most beginning beekeepers start with and they are, or the Italians and the Carniolans. The Italian in honeybee is probably the more common bee, to be kept in managed hives.

And one of the reasons why is because it's known for creating large populations, and they're excellent honey producers. They also have a very extremely mild temperament. So there are a very gentle bee to work with. And they're not, and I don't know if this is a correct term or not, they're not as swarmy as some other bees, although they will tend to swarm as well.

The one thing that you do need to watch out for is that they do tend to have large winter populations. And so you'll need to really look and watch that when you're in the throes of winter because they can go through their honey stores pretty quickly, so you'll have to watch for signs of starvation.

The second type of bee that most beginning beekeepers will start with is the Carniolan. They're also referred to as carnies and they were developed in the regions of Slovenia and the Balkan area. And they also are very calm, and have a gentle temperament. And what's kinda neat about those bees that's beneficial for us here in the Pacific Northwest, is that they developed in kind of a cold wet region. And so these bees will sometimes get out on days that maybe the Italians won't get out because there'll be a little bit colder. And the one thing though to watch with these bees is that they, opposite, they're very prone to swarming. And especially when that nectar flow hits, so you'll want to watch that; you don't want your bees to all of a sudden start swarming when you're trying to get that nectar flow going and trying to get as much honey being produced at that time. So the two, those are the two most common.

And then once beekeepers really start getting years under their belt, they might want to experiment with hybrid bees, the Russians and that the hygienic Queens. But, I think the Italians and Carniolans are probably the best bees to start with.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:05:18] I was going to say that implicit in the question, I think, to most people when they ask what species of honeybee, they don't realize that at least in the Western, you know what we have here are all one species.

And so you've pointed out that these are actually just the bees, the populations that we have in North America are sampling of populations from Europe...

Amber Reece: [00:05:38] And that these are they're non-native, so honeybees are non-native to the US. And so the, these two races of bees are the most common. Yes.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:05:50] Okay. Fantastic. All right. That's helps us dispel that first step. And I guess the question we'll move on to, people will want to know "what kind of bees should I start with?"

Anna, I imagine you've put as one of the questions that people frequently ask you, and imagine this time of year it's intense, "where do I purchase Queens, nucs, and packaged bees?"

How do you answer that question?

Anna Ashby: [00:06:14] Since this is going throughout the United States and where wherever the radio waves go...

Google is your friend. If you are in the US, I would Google bee clubs in your state or bee clubs in your area and see what comes up and talk to them. Craigslist is again, I don't know if Craigslist is international, but look on there. The local paper want ads, Facebook, beekeeping groups. You can ask there. And then beekeeping suppliers. Again, Google is your friend or some internet search engine, just Google beekeeping suppliers and see what they have.

And then you can say beekeeping suppliers in your area. They will know, and then you can contact them. I'm sure they would love that.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:07:06] I imagine for some people the whole notion of a beekeeping supplier seems foreign to them that there are these companies and many major us cities that actually stock all the things that you need.

You can go into a storeroom, at least when there's not restrictions and you can see the stuff.

Anna Ashby: [00:07:25] And you can get bees mailed to you. Which delights the post office I'm sure. Or you can drive to a pickup place and pick them up. You can get nucs or packages that way, Queens the same way. Or you could just set up and look for a swarm, get on swarm lists. Those would be my thoughts.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:07:54] So I remember we had an episode with Mandy Shaw from Portland Urban Beekeepers, and she pointed out in the span of a year, maybe, putting her name on the local swarm list. So a lot of the beekeeping clubs have a list so that when somebody calls and says, Oh, there's a swarm.

They call them and then so Mandy would get these calls and she was able to get all her bees through these swarms. Clearly for somebody starting out, that is not the way to go. That's a more advanced way of getting bees.

Anna Ashby: [00:08:24] Can be very intimidating for a new beekeeper.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:08:29] But you did mention as well that the bee clubs, that these are great ways to learn any of these intro questions.

There's usually a network or a community in most major cities where there'll be people there like Anna, and Amber, you both belong to bee clubs, who can give you advice directly. Yes. It does raise the question, which is Amber's next question that people frequently ask, is "how much does it cost?"

To get started in beekeeping. How much before I can go to the flow hive and pour the honey onto my toast in the morning, like I saw in the commercial.

Amber Reece: [00:09:07] Well, let's address the flow hive on another episode of PolliNation. We will assume that the beginning beekeeper is going to start out with a traditional hive setup.

And that's using the Langstroth hive. Keep in mind, beekeeping can be an expensive hobby when you're first starting out and starting out with brand new equipment. If you're lucky enough and somebody perhaps you can get loaners equipment or used equipment but keep in mind it can get expensive, fast. And what I would recommend is that you do a lot of reading first participate in a bee school and, or join your local bee club to make sure that this is actually an enterprise that you want to take on, because beekeeping it's changed. It's no longer about just putting boxes out in your backyard and just letting them be, sorry, but letting them be. You can't just let them do their own thing anymore. It's going to involve management, time management, your time, and a lot of thought needs to go into this before just running out to the store and purchasing your supplies. Because these are living beings and some consider them livestock.

And so you want to be able to have the time to take care of them and also know too that these are not going to be just one time fixed costs. They're going to have annual costs too. There's going to be upkeep costs of your wooden ware. So there's going to be replacements and something else to keep in mind too, is that it's recommended for beginning beekeepers to start with not one hive, but two, if your location can support that. Because it gives you greater flexibility to be able to balance out the two hives if you need to. If one's a little bit weaker, it offers you some combining opportunities as well.

Okay, so having mentioned that whether or not you start with an eight-frame traditional Langstroth hive setup, or a 10-frame and you purchase, all your tools, your safety equipment, and also the purchase of the bees, for a one hive set up, you're looking at about 650 to $700.

Add a second hive to that and add an additional $400, which includes the purchase of your bees. As Anna had mentioned, packages and nucs and stuff, and so that's involving those costs as well. So startup for about two hives, you're looking at close to a thousand dollars and that's with brand new equipment.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:12:05] And I remember an episode we did with Kim Flottum, and he started a beekeeping journal called "Three Years in Beekeeping" because those first three years... the colonies may not survive. You are still learning. And so those expenses on that front end can be a big investment.

Amber Reece: [00:12:23] Yeah and there will be some frustration for those first two years for beginning beekeepers. Be prepared to lose a colony or two. And those are learning experiences. And that's another benefit to start with two hives in case one of them doesn't make it that way there's not as much discouragement. But yeah, it's not an inexpensive hobby.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:12:51] Okay. Thanks for setting that up. And I guess this leads to Anna's question. I've heard this question a lot. "Why would I want to treat my bees with chemicals? I want them to live naturally." How do you answer that question of, why would you, if you're keeping bees, why would you even want to use chemicals?

Anna Ashby: [00:13:09] If you want your bees to stay alive? You need to in this day and age, unfortunately. So when we say chemicals, that doesn't necessarily mean something harsh, maybe it's not, I'll have to think about that. And then we'll backtrack a little bit, the reasons for doing any sort of intervention in bees is because we need to control a parasite, which is called the Varroa mite. Which as you are a beginning beekeeper, you'll start hearing about a lot. And if you do not control the Varroa mite, your hive will die most likely the first fall or winter. That's just the long and short of it. So to be a responsible beekeeper, or like Amber said, livestock owner, you need to give the bees the tools, which is lack of pressure, from the parasite so that they can survive.

So these Varroa mites feed on the bees and also vector viruses. So they compromise the bees' immune system. So they're compromised. And then they're injecting them with viruses and they leave an open wound. So the viruses have ready access to the bee's body. And typically that's what kills the colony.

By reducing the, by using chemicals of some sort, and we'll talk about that in a moment, then there's reduced pressure on the bees. So the bees that are healthier and are more likely to survive. Especially as a beginning beekeeper, there's so much to learn. Eventually down the road, if you want to explore other options and there are, and you can talk about other management options.

You just need to learn how to handle bees and learn the bee's lifecycle, and going through all the manipulations that you do. So it's just one less thing for a new beekeeper to learn. And it's all about the timing.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:15:28] It just reminds me of what Amber said about learning. Your bees are going to die, and learning. There's so many other reasons why a bee colony will die in your first few years. If you can at least know that the mites are under control, it allows you to learn. I think like you just, Oh, I went from too small a colony, or I didn't feed them enough, Varroa will just cancel all those lessons out.

Anna Ashby: [00:15:54] Yes. Yes it will. And so then once you've successfully overwintered bees for more than one year, it's not just a fluke. Then you can buy, then you will have more knowledge and skills under your belt. And you can start looking into more manipulative things like keeping the queen from laying for a period of time so you give a brood break. Or using drone comb removal, or getting the hygienic cleans. There's lots that you can do, but they take a lot of time. And again, it's all timing. You can't go off to a family wedding and you can't go on vacation. You are a slave to the bees.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:16:37] But these are methods of controlling Varroa mites without chemicals, but they do require advanced technique, you need some skill, you can't do this right off the bat. Even if you read it in the book and somebody says this is the best thing. It's they're fairly hard techniques.

Anna Ashby: [00:16:54] Yes, they are.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:16:57] Okay. That's great. It's not great. It's terrible. I wish we didn't have these parasites.

Yeah. Okay. The next question Amber, is where should I place my hives? I imagine you get that all the time. I'm starting to put shrubs in my yard and it's like, where do I put them? It's the same kind of question. Where do I put the hives? How do you answer that question?

Amber Reece: [00:17:15] All right. The first thing is to ask yourself, or if somebody is asking that question is, do you even have permission in the first place to place those hives where you want to? So are you placing them on your property? Your private property, are you wanting to place them in a public area? So make sure you've got permission first. And also where they'll be located, are they going to be secure or are they going to be out of harm’s way? Are they protected by fencing if you've got large animals on your property? Make sure that you can place them in an area that there's security for them, and also placed them in an area where you can easily assess them. So if you're living on property that is fairly large, and you have to cross two creeks to get to, and you're carrying all this material with you, are you? And you've got to go a quarter mile to get to them.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:18:25] You have to climb out a window into and go up a fire escape, or something.

Amber Reece: [00:18:29] Right? Yeah. So place them in areas where you can get to them relatively easy. I had a hive located probably about a mile away from my house on a friend's property and I can tell you, I didn't get to that hive as frequently as I did to the ones in my own backyard.

And so I felt that I neglected that hive of a little bit more, especially on cold achy, rainy days. And they had a real steep driveway. I didn't want to drive up that on icy days, to check on food storage.

So yeah, placing them in a spot where you can get to them easily. And also make sure too, if you've got more than one hive that you've got areas around them that you can work. You don't want them spaced real close together so that you end up bumping into them that can cause some issues and make the neighboring hives defensive.

So make sure that you've got room to work around them and you want to be able to work them from the side, or from behind, and not in front of the hives, because that's going to be blocking the bee's flight path. And that's also something to consider too, is the bees flight path versus your children's play path.

Try not to have them in the same direction. Try to have them face away from one another and everybody will be happy. Another thing to consider too, is the orientation of the hives. Bees like to get that early morning light. So in that case it would be a Southeast facing direction.

So I try to place my hives in a location where they can get that Southeast orientation. And then also you might want to consider a wind breaks and if you don't have a windbreak around And you're worried about maybe your top lid coming off is placing some type of weight on there, like a brick or a large rock.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:20:29] Where I hear this a lot from is, are people who try to keep bees on the coasts. I know we have some beekeepers in Astoria, and the wind is just fierce. You just need some, you really need like a sharper edge to break the wind.

Amber Reece: [00:20:42] Yeah. Or, even just using like half of a cinder block, just something really heavy to anchor that down.

And then another thing I would consider too, is having a water source nearby for the bees. So the bees they need water and they'll use water, especially in the summer to help cool their hives. They'll use that almost as for air conditioning with the movement of their wings, they're able to create a cooling effect.

And then of course they need water for drinking, but also to help with the curing of the honey, too, with diluting some of the honey. So you'll want to have a water source nearby and make sure to have that established early. And if you have that established early, then you train the bees more or less to always visit that area.

And if you can train them to have that water source on your property, they're less likely to go to your neighbor's bird bath or water fountain or swimming pool. This last spring 2020 my daughters, they were being very helpful. They said, “Hey mom, we're going to set out some Frisbees full of water for the bees so that they've got water.”

I'm like, great. That's a great idea. I come home and they have placed Frisbees with rocks in them on our retaining wall where I parked my car. The bees learned during spring and summer that's their to go place to get water and so there were constant bees flying around every time I wanted to get into my car.

So yes, bees learn where their water sources are. So those are some of the things I would take into consideration for figuring out where to place my hives.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:22:26] Those are five great questions. And we got five more, so let's take a quick break and we'll come back and Anna, you've got a question about swarms, so I'm looking forward to hearing how you answer that basic question.

Okay. We are back with a question I'm sure we've all heard many times my bees swarmed, now, what? Anna, how do you answer that question?

Anna Ashby: [00:22:56] Deep breaths. Take a deep breath. Don't hyperventilate. If you've watched them swarm which in itself is stunning. It is, it's one of the most exciting things you can ever see.

If they land in a spot where you can collect them, do. And if they don't land in a spot where you can collect them, maybe someone from a bee club would be willing to go to a riskier... by that I'm just assuming they're up too high, because that's what happens when my bees swarm, and that I don't get them because they're up beyond my reach because I'm not going to climb ladders way up high and use a bucket on the end of a long pole.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:23:38] Those are the tricky ones. What I think is like sometimes they're way up high and, personal safety is an issue. Because the bees themselves weigh something.

And so once... you're going to talk about this in a second, but once the bees come down, it's like you're on the top of a ladder and with this big weight suddenly in your arms. Yeah. But keep going.

Anna Ashby: [00:23:58] And bees flying everywhere.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:24:00] Oh, I forgot about that part.

Anna Ashby: [00:24:03] And it's usually hot too. So you're dripping sweat.

So if you can collect them, do so. Which means knocking them into a bucket or a Rubbermaid container or a cardboard box that doesn't have a hole in the bottom because we've had that issue. I don't understand why all the bees are gone. Oh, there's a hole.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:24:30] In my bucket.

Anna Ashby: [00:24:34] So anyway, this isn't really about collecting the swarm. Just calm down. It's a natural brood break. It's a natural part of a bee's life cycle. They're reproducing on a colony level. They've split. They were healthy enough that they figured they would be able to launch a satellite colony. Okay. Don't do anything with the hive that swarmed. Just everybody's all agitated. Just give them a day to settle down, and yourself.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:25:12] Have a drink and sit back. Okay.

Anna Ashby: [00:25:18] Yeah, and it'll maybe only takes a couple hours, but a day won't, 24 hours won't hurt. Okay. So the bees will cap, they'll have more than one queen cell, usually multiples. And about day eight or nine, right when the leavers have left.

So we still have more days. What, five, six, seven days until the Queens emerge. So that gives you the break there. You can go in, if there are 42 queen cells or a dozen queen cells... one, you can just do nothing and see what happens. If there's a lot of queen cells and this is a very populous hive, they just might think, wow, this is so fun. Let's do it again.

So that's, that's one of those situations where you kind of learn those things by experience by watching your bee go again and again. And again but anyway, you can't do nothing. And in a matter of time, about three weeks, you should be seeing eggs again. And don't panic. It takes three weeks, maybe a little bit earlier, but you have to leave time for the queen to emerge, for her exoskeleton and everything, to get all organized and strong and so that she then flies and mates, and then it takes a while for everything to get organized inside of her. And before she starts laying eggs. So if you don't see any eggs at first, wait another week and then look again.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:26:57] I think that's great advice. It does take a little bit of time. And the thing I remember once being with out with Dave Tarpey in a bee yard, and he pointed out to me that virgin Queens are extremely skiddish and weird and strange, and they do not like to be disturbed. And so in some ways, just leaving it shut for three weeks before, like you say, going in and checking it for eggs. She's going to come out and maybe, you may want to do some adjustments with queen cells, but really not constantly going in and trying to find, or just wait until she starts laying.

Anna Ashby: [00:27:29] Yeah. Give yourself a break.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:27:34] You're so good. You're great advice. I love that.

And I think I remember when we were developing that best practices for residential beekeepers, somebody pointed out, we have something like, we use the word swarm prevention because it's really inevitable. Even every beekeeper is going to experience it. There's no swarm avoidance. It just is something that's going to happen.

And you just have to... I like that advice of just staying calm and, assessing where you're at. That's such great advice.

Anna Ashby: [00:28:03] Yes.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:28:04] Our next question, which I know everybody asks. Everybody from two year old, as soon as they can speak onwards, how often should they expect to get stung? And will I develop an immunity to bees, the bee stings? Amber, how do you answer that one?

 Amber Reece: [00:28:22] Yes, there will be bee stings, unfortunately, but there are ways that you can minimize those from happening, but let's first kind of talk about the different types of bee stings that folks can get, or sorry, reactions to those bee stings.

And one of them is just the local reaction. Once you get stung it'll be discomfort. It may hurt. There might be some of the itchiness and redness and some of that swelling and that's what we would call a localized reaction. And that can last, 24 to 48 hours depending on how much venom was actually put into your skin.

The more adverse reaction is what we would call anaphylaxis reaction. And that's where you start to get hives across your skin. You might get nauseous, you could develop some cramps, it might be difficult to breathe. And if you start feeling those are having some of those symptoms, that's when you need to call emergency response relatively quickly, because that could develop into some pretty scary situations.

So those are the two types of reactions. But that anaphylaxis reaction, that is a really small percentage of the US population where that would actually occur in. And most of those folks know that they would respond to any type of sting and they would oftentimes carry an epi pen.

Now I am not a doctor. I do not work for a medical field, but I do know that that ice packs and Benadryl can help ease some of that discomfort, especially of the localized reactions. Now over time, beekeepers may become less reactive to some of these things, but I wouldn't necessarily say immune to them.

You might get stung multiple times and it might protect against some of those future allergic reactions. They might not be as strong. It might not get as much swelling, but anytime you've got an overabundance of that bee venom, depending on how many times you get stung, it can cause some serious health issues and not everyone's bodies are going to respond the same way.

That's the thing to keep in mind is that everybody's bodies are different. Now having said that, though, there are ways that you can minimize getting stung. And one of them is to really work your bees gently. So you're going to use your smoker. So you'll be smoking them. And that smoking them helps keep the bees calm.

It masks your scent. It encourages the bees to engorge on some of that honey. So then they're more apt to not pay as much attention to you. So just working them in a really calm, gentle manner and you approach them. I guess this would be what mindfulness, it's a mindfulness type activity. So just, yeah, just be really calm and gentle around them.

And if you happen to notice that the bees are getting a little agitated. When agitated, if they start bouncing off of your veil or start dive-bombing you a little bit, that's telling you that they might not be appreciating you getting into their home right now. And when you start noticing that, come back another day let them settle down.

As Anna is saying, is give them a little break and you take a little break, close things up and just come back another day. So that's one way to help minimize getting some of those stings. And also two, is work your bees when your kids aren't outside playing, when you don't have a whole bunch of neighbors around.

So just minimizing the number of people around. Because I remember observing the bees with my kids, and we were standing to the side and we were watching the bees and this was when they were little and they were just, the bees are coming in there. We could see all of the pollen coming in and we're just getting excited and watching them.

And the girls started getting a little animated and talking. My husband was also standing next to us and who is the one that got stung? My husband did, even though it was the girls that were moving around a lot and just being a little loud. So just by being calm and quiet around the bees helps minimize that too.

And also work the bees when they're not home. So work them when they're out foraging, so you have less of a population inside the hive. And also do it when you've got a good nectar flow going on. When you start working the bees come the summer when there's not as much nectar for them, they might start to get a little more defensive, not enjoying you being inside their home, and there might be more prone to sting at that point. But yeah, really the take home message here is just to work them gently, be calm, and also smoke them when you need to. And keep that smoker lit too. That's a key point because sometimes when you want to smoke them, you realized your smoker has already died out.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:33:58] That's one thing that I often run into people say I'm allergic to bees. And then you talked to them a little bit. It's Oh, how do you know that? It's because my wrist, I could not bend my wrist the next day. And it's that's what you were describing. Amber is a typical localized reaction. In some people, their very first thing, if they haven't been beekeeping at all, their knuckles may disappear.

Amber Reece: [00:34:19] Yeah and there will be some swelling and that's the other thing too, to watch for is usually that first sting you're okay. It's the second sting that you need to watch for to see what type of reactions you're going to be developing on more of a future basis. And then the other key too is, did you really get stung by a honeybee or was it a yellow jacket? Was it a bald face hornet? Was it was a paper wasp? Everybody says I got stung by a bee, but more than likely it was those nasty yellow jackets.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:34:52] Such a great transition to our next question. So Anna, you do a lot of ask the expert questions. So you deal a lot with public questions and not as a fellow ask an expert, which is this great service provided by the extension service, you can submit a gardening question, any question you get an answer. Anna, you answer a lot of those questions. I'm sure there comes this point in July and August. When you start getting yellow jacket questions. And I know the one that beekeepers asked me and they've asked you will yellow jacket traps, those little traps to hang from the trees, kill my bees?

Anna Ashby: [00:35:29] And the short answer is no, because the bees won't go in there. The attractant in those yellow jacket traps is a pheromone lure specifically aimed at yellow jackets. And they're the ones that go in there and by the thousands. So that was a short answer. For beekeepers out there, they can go to the Oregon OSU publications catalog and download the publication, Protecting Honeybees from Yellow Jacket Loss because yellow jackets late summer, so August, at least in the Pacific Northwest, because we have a lack of rain in the summer. We don't get rain from July, August and into September, some years, 10 weeks without rain. So it gets really dry. The insects have vanished and yellow jackets are hungry. They are looking to feed those developing Queens.

And so they naturally gravitate to honeybee colonies because whew. Look at all this food that's here. They have honey, they've been working hard. Let's go in and steal it. Ooh, they have larvae. Hey. Oh, look at all this meat here. And they're all here.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:36:55] You imagine that's what a yellow jackets brain sounds like.

That was the perfect. Yeah.

Anna Ashby: [00:36:59] To them, a honey bee colonies is just a feast pieced on wings. I guess that's off the question, isn't it?

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:37:05] No, this is really good. I do think that there's the question of whether the yellow jacket traps are going to kill the bees, but I think this whole question of protecting beehives at this critical period where the yellow jacket predation can get really extensive is really important.

As you pointed out the OSU extension catalog, and we'll put it in the show notes has a great guide on you as a beekeeper and how you can help your college chances to deal with this hungry hoard.

Anna Ashby: [00:37:38] Yeah. And yellow jackets are really useful. So you don't want to just mindlessly destroy them if you can protect your bees otherwise, because they eat a lot of things that we don't want in our gardens.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:37:52] Amber is doing a reluctant nod.

Amber Reece: [00:37:57] If only yellow jackets didn't drive me indoors when I try to eat outside on my deck.

Anna Ashby: [00:38:04] Yeah.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:38:05] Yeah. That's the one thing about, Western Oregon is it's nice and dry but man, can't eat outside.

All right. So Amber, next question. Number nine on our list. Can I have a honeybee hive in my backyard if I live in the city, how many hives should I start with and or have?

Amber Reece: [00:38:27] Yes and no. So one of the things you'll want to check is that some municipalities and counties, they might have limits on the number of colonies that you can have on your property.

And other places may not have any limits at all. So you'll want to find out what those colony limits are... okay. So a hive is what a colony lives in and some people get that terminology a little mixed up. So find out from the area that you live in city, town, County, if there are any rules against the number of hives that you can have in your backyard. And also some neighborhoods, there's a number of neighborhoods now that have HOAs and, or CC&Rs. And so you'll want to double check those too. Some may not allow bees may or may not be considered livestock and livestock may or may not be allowed within the city limits where you are.

I know some HOAs don't allow chickens, and also bees would fall into that category too. So really check out those rules. And the second thing that I think is really important is be sure to talk with your neighbors. Talk with your neighbors about beekeeping before you set up your hives or your small little apiary.

It's an important thing to do. It's educational for your neighbors and it's also a common courtesy. And a lot of neighbors they, again, they might be under the assumption that honeybees act the same way that yellow jackets do. And so there's a really good educational opportunity there to talk about the differences between yellow jackets and or other wasps compared to honeybees and their behavior and temperament.

And it's always a good idea too, to make sure your neighbors get a jar of honey every year, too. And as Anna was talking about swarms, I have found my neighbors to be a great resource for swarms because they've got my number and they can call me and say, "Hey, Amber, I've got a swarm in my backyard," and I can just say, great, are you okay if I come in and collect them?

And just having a really good relationship with your neighbors, I think is key. Get them on board too, with your project. Either way make sure that you can manage them. You're going to want to know how many hives you feel comfortable managing. So don't, if you're a beginning beekeeper taking on 10 hives would be astronomical. You're already at a learning curve, just trying to figure out the bee’s lifecycle, the different seasonal management that you have to take on. So starting with 10 might be way too high. So start with the number of hives that you feel comfortable managing.

Another thing too, is only add hives if you feel your experience level has increased. And always too, monitor for defensiveness of your hives. So if your hives start to get a little defensive, that could cause for some nuisance issues, especially with your neighbors.

And so you'll want to make sure that your bees still have that gentle temperament and figure out ways that you can diminish the defensiveness of those hives. And those are the key points that I would consider. Placing those hives in your backyards and dealing with how many you feel comfortable working with.

So again, I go back to beginning beekeepers starting with one or two hives, and then working your way up from there. And keep in mind to naturally they're just going to increase on you. Cause as your bees start to swarm you're going to collect them. Your two hives have now become four. Your four have now become eight. And so it can be a growing thing.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:42:31] And it does remind me here in Oregon, and Amber, you were play a big role in getting education out on this, we do have another OSU publication that we'll have in the show notes that kind of walks you through the steps to take for keeping bees in residential areas. And in some areas, unfortunately, as you're mentioning Amber, that will be either within an HOA or something, but even more broadly in a whole city, where bees aren't permitted.

Amber Reece: [00:42:55] That's true. And I do find education is the key on this. And so for instance I belong, or the neighborhood that I am in has an HOA, and they have restrictions against having chickens because they're considered livestock.

I really wanted honeybees. So what I did, and I think my daughters helped too, is we put together a small little presentation and said, this is what we're going to do with honeybees. Are you okay if we do this? And the HOA board was on board with it, but they did say we would like you to limit the number of hives that you have. That's great. I can do that.

And they also didn't want my hives painted. Like fluorescent pink or bright orange. Yeah. I know they wanted them to blend in with kind of the natural surrounding, because we don't have a fenced backyard, and there's actually a little bit of a trail that goes in our backyard.

And they didn't want them to be really obnoxious. And again, that adds to part of the security. So if I have big, bright orange, pink hives sitting out there, that's pretty eye-catching. But if I can camouflage my hives a little bit, then people are less likely to see them.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:44:15] Folks, if you want to have fluorescent pink colonies, move to Malheur.

Okay. Last question. Anna, this is a great question. I save this to last, cause this is what people are going to be in this situation in just a couple months. They're going to get their package. They're going to get their nuc and they want to know how long do I feed it? When does the umbilical cord get cut?

Anna Ashby: [00:44:39] Yeah, it's hard. It's hard because they're your babies.

But bees are pretty much self-sufficient. Once there are flowers blooming, they can survive on their own. What you're doing by feeding is giving them a boost. If you get a package, that mean they have no comb drawn. So they would have to draw comb and store honey in order to and raise brood in order to survive the winner.

If you have a new nucleus, if you've purchased a nucleus colony, they come with the original three, four or five frames, but they still have the rest of your eight or 10 frames in two boxes that they need to fill out. So by feeding them, you are making it easier for the bees and it saves them time and it saves them energy and feeds their wax production.

It stimulates them to produce wax. So the question is, how long do you feed them? So one box, you wait until there's 80% of the frames are drawn. And then you can add the second box. You still keep feeding until that one is 80% drawn, and then you can stop feeding them.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:46:08] That is such great advice. I've run into people who have this problem, where they come out of the first season without enough drawn comb. And the way that you've described it, just really making it geared towards that  you stop feeding when you have enough comb drawn out, because you're really using that syrup to draw the comb out. So sensible.

You've helped a lot of people just cause they come out of the, they go into winter with there's nothing worse than going into winter with four or five drawn comb and a bunch of foundation on the edge. That's a terrible state of affairs.

Anna Ashby: [00:46:44] Yeah. And they have to draw the comb in the honey supers on their own. Cause otherwise you're going to have sugar syrup honey. Yummy.

Andony Melathopoulos: [00:46:58] Okay guys. This is fantastic. These are 10 great tips. And these are 10 questions, if you're just starting with beekeeping. Invariably, they're going to come to your head and you've really had some expert people guide you through. Two beekeepers who've gone through a lot of training, but also have gone through a lot of beekeeping, to bring you this advice. So thanks so much for joining us today.

Anna Ashby: [00:47:22] Thank you.

Amber Reece: [00:47:23] And thank you for having us.